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Author Topic: Raising tots to be bilingual: A comment  (Read 1063 times)
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Guest
Guest
« on: December 18, 2003, 09:35:23 PM »

hola amigo...


I do not clearly understand your point... but if I get it right it
is a vote for independent learning... you have my support on that
one.. SmileySmiley

Peace
Tim



> > Thus the
> > key should not be to identify an age at which one should or
should not
> > start learning new material, yet instead to identify the features
that
> > individuals use to excel in learning development based on their
own
> > situation.
>
> A teacher asked me my opinion, and I surprised him and myself by
saying,
> after leaving college. The more he tried to reason with me, the
more I
> liked the fact I learned Japanese, etc by myself.
>
> --
> Greg Matheson



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« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2003, 02:23:30 PM »

Stephen Krashen wrote:

> I understand parents' desires to "raise tots to be multilingual" (The

> Practical Linguist, Nov. 29), but there is no need for
> Japanese-speaking parents to talk their children in English. The
> advantages are slight and can be had elsewhere, and there are
dangers.

I did not read the article and most likely will not take the time to
read it. Yet a related thought...

It sure seems to me that parental involvement in a child's education is
all good. The encouragement which arises from an environment where
parents take an active interest in their child's learning has a
many-fold benefit which can not easily be ignored.

Whether that involvement may be through encouraging the use of a
foreign language, assisting in math skills or helping a child to master
a new concept.. the postive effect of parent-child interaction should
far offset any normal situation of honest mis-education. thinking
further... since when has formal education been without flaw? Thus the
risk of educating imperfections from parent to child should be no more
a risk than poor formal learning, or informal learning for that matter.



> By far the easiest way to make sure children master other languages
> are good programs in school, programs that fill the classroom hour
> with interesting projects, games, and discussions, and that provide
> children with lots of interesting reading, including comics,
> magazines and good novels.


I once again offer a twist... good schooling can be good.. yet bad
schooling can be very bad...

In a system that is dedicated to learner development you would be right
on, yet far too often schooling systems are devoted to political
motives ingrained in indoctrination. Thus teachers are not trained to
offer constructivist techniques; students are enslaved to learn in a
heavily process oriented and unforgiving curricula, while relation to
human development is lost in the agenda of making square pegs fit in
round holes.




The research strongly supports this
> approach, but most foreign language programs hold on to painful and
> inefficient methods that overemphasize grammar and memorization of
> vocabulary.


Well-said... My personal opinion is that all learners must first learn
how to learn, so that they can be freed from such nonsense of
programmed indoctrination. Yet many systems of schooling remain so
terribly ingrained in behaviorist processes which result in schooling
taking on the task of social legitimization, elitism and stratification
based on permission to advance according to ones ability to follow.




Those who do a great deal of pleasure reading in a second
> language automatically develop a large vocabulary and as well as high

> levels of grammatical accuracy.


Yet schools are not needed for such advancements. The best foreign
language learners I have met have always been those who have taken an
outside interest to advance their learning through self-motivating
techniques. Reading is wonderful for those who enjoy reading, yet
learning a language neither starts nor stops with reading alone. -- if
one has not learned how to learn (how to process thoughts -fight with
information and come to judgment), then reading, writing, speaking and
listening will go in and out equally as fast.



Research also tells us that there is
> no need to begin super-early; in fact, those who begin second
> languages later progress faster. It is more efficient to start at age

> ten than at age five.


Not being a language learning specialist I can not easily comment on
this as I do not read the literature in the field... Yet it seems to me
that each person is unique in that they are exposed to learning
materials, environments, are encouraged at different levels. Thus the
key should not be to identify an age at which one should or should not
start learning new material, yet instead to identify the features that
individuals use to excel in learning development based on their own
situation.


>
> Parents' use of a foreign language with their children can backfire
> when parents do not speak the language well and communication is
> imperfect. Imperfect parent-child communication can cripple emotional

> and intellectual development. It isn't worth taking the chance.


Yet lack of parental concern for child development can cripple a
child's learning development not to mention emotional and social
development...

Maybe it should be left up to the parent to self-assess if they have
the capability to help their child advance. Robert Feynman had some
interesting related thoughts on this topic (discussing what he learned
from his father and the point he felt he passed up his father's ability
to teach him new things) in his best selling book "What Do You Care
What Other People Think".


Peace
Tim


=====
John T. Denny M.S.Ed., Ph.D.
International Development Studies
Kyoto University
Graduate School of Human and Environmental Sciences
http://www.geocities.com/timdenny66/resume.html
---
"learning, training and indoctrination follow three starkly
different objectives; yet sadly so, too often 'formal education'
is represented by the latter" J.T. Denny 2003

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing.
http://photos.yahoo.com/


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« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2003, 11:57:17 PM »

Sent to the Daily Yomiuri, Japan, November 29, 2003

I understand parents' desires to "raise tots to be multilingual" (The
Practical Linguist, Nov. 29), but there is no need for
Japanese-speaking parents to talk their children in English. The
advantages are slight and can be had elsewhere, and there are dangers.

By far the easiest way to make sure children master other languages
are good programs in school, programs that fill the classroom hour
with interesting projects, games, and discussions, and that provide
children with lots of interesting reading, including comics,
magazines and good novels. The research strongly supports this
approach, but most foreign language programs hold on to painful and
inefficient methods that overemphasize grammar and memorization of
vocabulary. Those who do a great deal of pleasure reading in a second
language automatically develop a large vocabulary and as well as high
levels of grammatical accuracy. Research also tells us that there is
no need to begin super-early; in fact, those who begin second
languages later progress faster. It is more efficient to start at age
ten than at age five.

Parents' use of a foreign language with their children can backfire
when parents do not speak the language well and communication is
imperfect. Imperfect parent-child communication can cripple emotional
and intellectual development. It isn't worth taking the chance.

Stephen Krashen
Professor Emeritus
University of Southern California

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/newse/20031128wob1.htm


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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